Starbucks customer often has to argue for a discounted drink. Should she have to?

After many times of paying $3.90 plus tax for a Skinny Cinnamon Dolce Latte, Giselle Matsui finally figured out that she could order the same drink off the make-your-own latte list, specifying non-fat milk and a shot of cinnamon syrup. It would save her 40 cents a drink. She's persuaded the baristas at her hometown Starbucks to charge her the make-your-own price, but everywhere else, there’s a fight at the counter. What's your ruling on this? Read "Starbucks thwarts woman's effort to pay 40 cents less per cup"

Comments

[Jonny]

A customer comes into my starbucks every day with her own cup that she insists is a tall & always argues if we charge her for a grande.

I have taken a grande starbucks cup, filled it with water, and *poured* it into her for-here cup. It fits exactly and yet she insists it's a tall.

Some people are cheapskates, the end!

[Coffee Soldier]

Why doesn't someone just suggest she get a registered Starbucks card and get free syrup? Or get a gold card and get 10% off which is almost .40 cents in this situation....Problem solved.....new topic.

[TastyMacchiato]

What about the people who get "two shots of espresso in a tall cup, and just top it off with steamed milk?" I think you should charge for what the drink IS, but because of the "Just Say Yes" policy, it won't fly unless your manager is right next to you. It would be nice if the build your own menu agreed with the rest of the menu, though.

[frozen-barista]

Often I will just punch in the nonfat latte with the sf syrup, sometimes I tell them to order it that way, sometimes I don't. From the article...I don't see how cinnamon dolce is premium.

[bdanfers]

The key word here is 'premium' syrup. Dolce is priced like a sauce drink rather than a syrup drink, even though it's made with a syrup. Technically it shouldn't be a free syrup any more than mocha is.

[bigredbarista]

as a barista we must SAY YES. cmon guys. yeah its annoying for a customer to do that, but remember what we learned in training?

I'm sorry, what exactly is "make your own latte"? Do we have that on our board?

From the article: "Typically, Giselle Matsui needs two of them to make it through her waking hours."

"Needs"...it's a foo-foo coffee drink, not oxygen.

[DD]

I think it is Starbucks' fault for not setting the price right so that it matches up.

It's the same thing with Americano -- a Venti costs less than a Tall with 2 extra shots, so when I want a 4x Tall Americano, I ask for a Venti in a Tall cup instead.

Never had a problem.

Yeah I'm a bit lost on this build-your-own thing. Huh? What are they talking about?

[Sara]

yeah, i agree with the comment about getting a registered starbucks card. She would get the syrup for free. I do this all the time. Seriously, how hard is that?

[Globalguy]

Yep, well not exactly "make your own latte" but you can order customized beverages (your choice or syrups and milks). It should be listed on the first board panel under Espresso Beverages I think.

[Pat Nerr]

It sure is a good thing for Starbucks and more importantly their customers that they've complicated their pricing structure and ingredients list enough to annoy everyone.

Go back and spend some time on the menu pricing. Stop making one off specialty beverages with special prices that can be duplicated at a cheaper price with a half-head full of brains.

Oh... and bring back Mocha Mondays!

[firebus]

i'm on the "just say yes side" for this particular case.

it makes my igry when a menu has the same item for two prices.

or bundles that cost more (or equal to) the component parts (taco used to do that with their millions of tacos in a box "deal").

if starbucks is going to make it possible for me to order the same drink for cheaper by being dumb about their menu, then the barista should respect that.

for the general case, where the customer really is wrong, greedy, horrible, etc. i'm willing to bet that "just say yes" is the policy that makes the most money for your store, or else it wouldn't be starbucks policy.

Come on. It like 10 cents. Who cares. Why make a big deal about it. We had a customer who did the exact same thing and guess what, we took the time to get to know her. And now she is a regular. Take the time to connect rather than argue. That 10 cents is not going to effect any of us and could turn into more money if you do it right.

[Andrew]

"Just Say Yes" is not a policy - but a tool to be utilized when you don't know what to do or when considering special requests.

If a customer comes into our store and askes for a free biscotti because "the competition does it" - do I say yes? No. Taking that biscotti and eating it is theft because it's a product you have to pay for. JSY does not overrule fiscal and inventory responsibility.

I once had a customer ask one of my friends working to steam some goats milk for her latte she brought from home. Does JSY apply? NO WAY. Health Code overrules your need for steamed goats milk.

"Can I have two extra shots in my coffee for free?" No sir, I'm sorry, we charge .55 cents for extra shots. Did I use JSY? Nope. Sorry. Extra shots cost money. Again, fiscal responsibility for a request way beyond common sense.

When there are policies in writing that should be followed - the JSY does not overwrite them.

JSY was created to aid barista's when making decisions like - can I get two extra pumps of vanilla in my latte?
Can I get it made extra hot?
Can I get a double cup?
A triple cup?
A glass of water with light ice?
My tea shaken extra hard?
The freshest coffee availabe?
That lemon loaf in the back with the extra yummy looking frosting?
Sure! I'd love to just say yes a million times over to all of these requests because they are legitimate and help us create the legendary experience we pride ourselves in giving.

Just Say Yes does not, and should not, let customers take advantage of us. End of story.

As for that customer - get a registered card and stop crying.

[Meghan]

If they can figure out how to piece a drink together to get it cheaper and it's still a legit drink, why not? The example in the article falls in the "legit drink" category: it's a flavored latte. However, I don't think she has the right to give the barista crap for doing his/her job. It's the manager's job to tell the barista how to charge things, not the customer's.

There has to be a line drawn, though. Like TastyMacchiato's example: whoever said that steamed milk was complimentary? [Disclaimer: I worked at Caribou longer than I did at Starbucks, so I might be mistaken about this.] You wouldn't ask for a bowl of plain noodles at a restaurant and say, "just top it off with some pasta sauce" and not expect to be charged for spaghetti.

[LEGENDARY OR BUST]

Did you all read comments after the article in that Minneapolis newspaper? Quite insightful. A lot of readers there are shocked that people pay DAILY for a 3-4 dollar coffee drink.

Sometimes I forget that people who pay these prices daily at my store are 90% regulars -- that is how I know everyone's names and drinks.

Basically, I serve about 200 people or so a day plus a few "guests." (people who just happened to drop by and maybe won't come back for a very long time).

[lattegrande]

Just be glad that your parents didn't teach you that this kind of behavior is how a mature adult conducts themselves. Every day is there's a new cheapskate who thinks they're smarter than everyone else. Obviously the amount of time that they spend trying to explain how right they are and the following discussion/argument with the cashier is worth 40 cents to them. We should have pity on them that their time is so worthless. Yes the pricing structure is stupid, what should we expect? So we should just let them have what they want and be thankful that we aren't as small as they are.

[CoffeeMaster33]

It makes me wider if part of the price is the topping. This is the same as an eggnog lattee. You could ask for a grande latter made with egg nog, and it'd be the same price as a soy lattee. On the other hand, this doesn't explain the price difference between a mocha and a white mocha.

In my personal experience, I often drink a regular lattee with two pumps of gingerbread. I don't want whip or Ginger topping, so I don't want to he charged for a whole gingersnap lattee. I'm just adding two pumps of a syrup to my drink. On the other hand, my registered card takes care of any discrepancies, so I'm happy!

[Beantown Barista]

When Peppermint Mocha Twists were introduced this year, I would charge people who asked for a PMT with no whip for a mocha and add peppermint syrup because it was cheaper, and the only difference was the peppermint whip and chocolate shavings on top. Now that it's a RED drink, I've stopped doing that, but then again it's probably because I think $4.57 for a venti drink is ridiculous.

[maggiemunkee]

part of the problem is that when cinnamon dolce latte was added last year as a promotional drink, it was added at the promotional price, which is $0.40 more than typical flavored latte. but when it was decided that cinnamon dolce would stick around permanently, they did not remove the promo price/button from the POS. i don't think it's this woman's fault. if someone ever mentions this to me, i will absolutely ring it as latte add syrup.

[Mike B.]

There's a customer that always gets pissed at my store because her skinny CDL was wrang up wrong. You're supposed to sub the SF CD syrup with the skny latte button.

And about the make it your own version of the drink. Use the cinamon dolce latter button, don't charge for a reg latter with the syrup. The reason it's more expensive is cause it gets the whip and cinamon on top, also because it is supposed to be a better drink than the rest.

she should be charged for the syrup even if it's only one pump (not a shot that's dunkin donuts speak). .... the syrup does cost more than other syrups too.

[Court]

A similar moment happened in my drive-thru today, a women asked for a grande peppermint mocha, and we have been asked to ring that as a peppermint mocha twist for the (starbucks)red movement, and she asked me to ring it as add peppermint so her registered sbux card would take the syrup cost off, saving her 30 cents. I told her about how 5 cents is donated he response was just that, I don't want to donate just want to save my money...

I would charge it as Latte add CD Syrup, but explain that it would not default with whip or CD sprinkles. We can add whip if she wants it, since it is a free addition to any drink, but if she wants the sprinkles it needs to be charged at the promo price.

Speaking of which, can someone explain why a espresso con pana is more than an espresso, if whip is supposed to be a free addition to any drink? I've never been able to understand that.

Lastly, here is the most ridiculous ordering problem I have ever encountered. A women came in once and said she wanted a soy latte, with pumps of chai syrup. She argued the barista rang the drink in as a chai, add soy, add shots, so we rang it as a latte, add soy, add chai, too which she argued again that her registered card did not take the charge of the chai of (because its not supposed to). We "Just Said Yes" (against my better judgment) and ended up charging the drink as a latte add soy. Then, she asked us to remake the drink twice.

[Venti Urnex Latte]

This customer is absolutely correct. Starbucks signage should indicate prices that are accurate and non-ambiguous. If the price comes out several different ways depending on how it is ordered, then Starbucks is at fault, and if the customer orders the drink the lower-priced way, good for her.

We have a sign that says what hours we are open. When I began with Starbucks, we closed 15 mins before the written time. That always bugged me. It isn't that hard to change the sign to be correct. We should have signs that are not confusing and not ambiguous. (Then we got a new manager who was more clued in and made the actual hours line up with the posted hours.)

A similar-but-different problem comes up with children's hot chocolates vs. small hot chocolates. It creates a lot of bad blood. There should be a better policy on that.

Even the PR person admits to "confusion" in the pricing structure. In the absence of a sign clearly stating that when different ways of ordering lead to different prices the higher price will prevail, this customer has a completely valid complaint.

[betsy]

I think that the difference is between a CDL and a L with CD in the syrup box. If I'm making a latte with CD syrup, I'm spending less time putting on whip and powder so it should cost a bit less. However, if the customer wants the full deal, then the barista should not ring as a Latte + CD Syrup.

I've noticed problems where one barista will give a customer a "deal" and then another barista looks like the bad guy if they don't give the customer that same deal. For example, a customer came in the other day and asked for a french press and said that she only gets charged for a grande drip and quoted the price. Not wanted to make a big deal, I just charged her for the grande, but now that woman will expect the lower price even though she should be charged much more for the whole press pot.

[Kenya?Yukon!]

Ah, my favorite pet peeve!
The self-entitlement-because-I-go-to-Starbucks psychosis!
If a customer orders say a mocha and they get a caramel macciato, they have the right to complain. If they ordered soy and got breve, again, they are right. But just because one time a partner didn't charge you for 3 pumps of syrup X in a grande instead of the standard 4 doesn't mean that you get it for free for life. Just because one time a barista was kind enough to offer you a free shot of espresso, doesn't give any customer the right to get free shots every time. You give an inch, people expect a mile. We are not talking about customer who are over charged or swindled out of hundreds of dollars. These are people getting bent out of shape over 10 cents. Ok you'll argue that over time that adds up. If you get say two lattes a day and save ten cents on each, so 20x7 is 1.40 a week, so that's $72.80 a year. Even with this horrid economy, what is saving 70 bucks a year going to get you?
I concur that Starbucks needs to pay attention more to these pricing conflicts, but people, is it really worth the energy and the loss of braincells to get your undies in a funk over a measly 10 cents a day? Get a life. If you've conditioned yourself that you "need" your latte in the morning, that's the fault of your own weak will power. We offer coffee, a pleasant atmosphere (well as long as we can with all this, um, transition), and the ability to make your drink they way it is, all with a smile. We don't hold a gun up to your face and demand that you get 5 shots of espresso in your latte. It's always easier to blame someone else for your own vices.
Customers are the most important part of our business, but it does not mean that because you happen to hold stock in the company or that you come in everyday that we have to give you a discount. Pay for what you ordered, and if you're lucky enough to get a freebie now and then, awesome! Don't get greedy and ruin it for us all.

[Sbuxtown]

This is crap! She can do this with any starbucks drink especially if she has a registered starbucks card. The bigger problem is she wants it viewed as a fight with starbucks when everyone else pays the real price and has no major issue with it. She is trying to paint herself as a victim which is the worse part of this. I have less of a problem with her local store that she visits every day maybe giving her that discount. While it is still unfair I could see giving regulars the discount from time to time. But to make it an issue at every Sbux she goes to is just arrogant and rude! Its just sad that she wants to be seen as the one who has the problem and that we need to fix our own set pricing system.

[Melody]

I'm with the customer here. Just say yes. If you lose your customers over this, it will be much harder to get them back later, then just to keep them now. This was mentioned a couple of times during the investor relations conference call ...

@Betsy: If she is only taking with her a "grande" size cup of coffee, though you've made it in a french press, my understanding is that Starbucks policy is that she is charged for a "grande". You pay for the amount you actually receive. Right?

I'm a strong believer in resolving this disputes in favor of the customer, under *most* circumstances. I just bought one pound of Starbucks Bali Batur Highlands coffee (a Clover offering). The price on the menu board says $8.00/half pound. (That is the only price given). Barista rings in the sku and it rang up as $19.00.

I said, "wait. I think 8 and 8 is $16 and not $19."

There was no fuss, and no discussion, somehow (some magical pressing of buttons), next thing I knew I was being charged $16 and not $19 for the pound of coffee. I don't see myself as being "cheap" here. ??

[camspi]

She is paying for a latte and the syrup, so I would do it how she requested it. She's smart and I bet kinda sassy. I would like her as a customer, lol.
Didn't realize the price difference til now.

[Very Irritated Partner]

I am disgusted after watching Mr Schultz's interview. He continues to promote health insurance for part time partners. Stop sugar coating it! There has never been a guarantee for a part time partner to recieve 20 hours a week to be eligible for health benefits. For the part time partners who are lucky enough to receive health benefits get ready to lose them. The labor cuts are in place to rid the company of part time partners. This will save Starbucks millions of not having to pay health insurance, vacation, and personal days while saving their face. Through this recession we still find the financial abiltiy to take care of people with aids in Africa donating money through (RED) meanwhile Starbucks cannot fullfill sufficient hours and health insurance for the partners who are making these beverages. Store managers are now having to work 50-60 hrs a week now with the labor cuts....get ready for the lawsuits to begin again. If you are a part time parent or student and have lost your hours and your insurance I am sorry and I am sorry that this company sugar coats everything it does and has never been close to what you thought you signed up for.

[Venti Urnex Latte]

It is not a question of cheapness or whether the 40 cents a day adds up to a substantial sum or whether she is a regular customer. It is a question of Starbucks posting its prices properly. Starbucks can charge $20 for a drink if it wants, and the customer can choose to pay the posted price, or not. Starbucks is a business and should follow accepted businesses practices, which include posting an accurate price for the product and NOT a confusing, ambiguous price that varies according to how the drink is ordered.

Melody,
I agree, but realize that some customers are not as kind and courteous as you are. I have no problem making decisions like that when a customer looks at the information, points out a conflict, and asks for a correction. Many (or perhaps most) customers in a situation get very hostile very quickly, and unfortunately the natural response at times is to get hostile in return.

[SoyMMM]

I hate, hate, hate, hate cheaters and cheap people.

I don't know if this lady falls into either of those categories, in my opinion (as I'm sure most baristas would say) if she's getting whip and CD sprinkles, ring it as a CDL, if not, go ahead and ring it as a L + CD if she wants. I don't have a problem with that.

But all of you "Iced Venti Americano no water so I can take it to the condiment bar and make myself a latte" people?

You "Iced Venti Passion Tea no ice make sure that cup is filled to the top with tea with an extra cup and a cup of ice on the side" people?

You "Venti 24 oz Frappuccino split into two Tall 12 oz cups" people?

I hate you.

Partially for ripping off the company, and partially because all of the other honest people come in and pay the price that is asked for what they want and don't make a federal case about it.

I'm all about saving money, don't get me wrong. But the people who provide the service that I come in for have the right to name their price, and I have the right to decide whether or not I'm willing to pay it.

[Allie]

If it were me, I would have Just Said Yes. Of course, if she had asked the bar barista if she could "Please put some whip on top? And... the cinnamon dolce powder? I like it that way. Thanks." with the tone of voice and facial expression that implied she was trying to pull one over on us, I would have walked over and said, "Ma'am, you ordered a latte with cinnamon dolce syrup. If you wanted the extra stuff, you shouldn't have argued with me over 40 cents. Have a nice day!"

I will do anything for a customer that isn't self-righteous, rude, expectant of special treatment or 'deals,' slick, or acts ignorant. Really, all you have to do is be sort of nice and I will just say yes to whatever you want and do it gladly. You get more bees with honey.

[Kenya?Yukon!]

Melody-
You are certainly not being cheap, because you were incorrectly charged for what you purchased. As you said, there was no fuss. You are obviously a mature rational person(and thank the stars for that!). But sadly, you are a minority in this world. The individuals whom I am talking about (and I feel that this woman is one of them) would be personally insulted over this mistake, and would demand their coffee to be free or to be given a recovery coupon. If the barista said no, then it's all out war... "Just Say Yes!" even if common sense says other wise.
Sigh. I'm not happy writing about this. I honestly expect better from humanity, but alas.
I am not the type of person who if, just for random example, I was charged $4.99 for a sandwich that was listed for $4.59, that would get furious and declare to never go to that establishment again. I would bring it to their attention, and if it was accidentally priced wrong, so be it. It's 40 cents. I am aware the person sitting behind the cash register isn't the one who decides what costs what and isn't the one who made the mistake to begin with (like when a customer berates a register partner over a mistake the partner on bar made). I am aware that this establishment wasn't secretly planning to "get me" for 40 cents. It was a mistake and the only thing different about me after the experience is that I paid 40 cents more than I thought I was going to. I go home, do my thing (maybe find another 40 cents in my couch) and go on. Maybe I'm understanding life incorrectly?

[Kenya?Yukon!]

Allie-

Awesome! That's what I'm talking about it! I'm the same way...

Whatever !!!

Let's not get self rightous over a CDL.

[dixiebarista]

The only apparent difference I see between a SKCDL and any of the other drinks is the topper. What's so special about ground cinnamon mixed with sugar, which we offer separately for free? 99% of the time someone orders a "cinnamon dolce latte (pause) skinny" and it is rung accordingly. However, when my daily regular super-nice customer comes in, she gets the price that makes her registered starbucks card save the most money.

Also, does a SKCL have caramel sauce on it? If so, why is it the same price as a SKVL or SKHL?

[Sue Matra]

I concur with the poster above:

Venti Frappuccino split into two cups?

You're cheap, have no shame, and I hate you too.

[Me]

maggiemunkee had it right. I actually pointed this one out a long time ago in one of the open threads.
Anyway, if you use the registered starbucks card it doesn't even matter how you ring it in, it takes the syrup off.
Even though people keep saying whipped cream is free, NO it is not. It is actually quite expensive. And this is the reason why the drinks coming with whip as a default (usually the promo drinks) are a bit more expensive than just a latte add syrup. We just don't charge the odd customer having a vanilla latte with whip extra, because this isn't happening a lot.
Maybe it would be easier for customers if we just had a menu stating the cost of shots, milk, syrup, whip and toppings and then they can really built their own drinks. But then, I guess 95 % of the customers would be rather confused than relieved with such a system.
Seriously folks, if you only have a CDL every few months it doesn't matter if it is 40 cents more expensive or not (I still think it shouldn't be, but it REALLY doesn't matter). If you have one or more every day it adds up of course. But then you should really get a registered starbucks card and be happy to save 75 cents every time you use it instead of 35 cents the vanilla latte drinker saves.

Oh and about the caramel latte. It has no caramel sauce on top. This would cost extra. It doesn't come with whip as a default either. It is not a promo drink nor was it recently.

[Coffee Mistress]

@dixiebarista,
No, a SKCL late does not get caramel sauce. Caramel sauce is NOT sugar free, therefore NOT skinny. Also, a regular Caramel Latte does not get caramel sauce so neither should the skinny version. (If a customer wants caramel sauce on a caramel latte, that is an additional charge.) Case in point, a SFV, Nonfat Caramel Macchiato is not a Skinny Caramel Macchiato because of the caramel sauce. All of this is in your store copy of the BRM.

[Me]

Yes, some customers are very cheap. I sometimes wonder why they even come in. I've had a customer once ordering a kids hot chocolate, split into two tall cups and filled with whipped cream to the top and above. They didn't even tip.
And yes, a short coffee in a venti mug and asking for soy as a condiment to fill the mug to the top is very cheap as well. Paying 1.50 for the coffee and adding soy for almost 2.00 on top can't be right. Beside, your coffee is now COLD.
I do serve you people, even with a smile, but I don't like it.
You couldn't abuse another coffee shop that way.
And if more people start abusing our friendliness and JSY we will have to rethink our strategy, just as we had to do with the return policies. Remember the days when we were famous for a very customer friendly return policy? We were able to return things without a receipt and without a time limit. Yeah, long gone. Because of abuse of the system.

[coffeeguy]

I hate adults who order a kids hot chocolate. "Can you steam that to 160." NO.

[Melody]

Coffeeguy, what's wrong with ordering a "kid's hot chocolate"? Is that the same thing as ordering a "short"? "Short" was an essential part of the menu for the first decade of the company. That one, I don't get at all.

I also don't see the problem in giving two tall cups to the person who wants to split a Venti frap.

I'd still love input on Betsy's french press situation mentioned above ...

In total honesty, "just say yes" still makes sense. It will cost more to try and win back customers after they've left disgruntled because they didn't get two cups for their Venti frap (or they feel like they got a negative atmosphere for asking that) than to keep them as your customers! Starbucks can afford "just say yes". This isn't such a huge problem, and Starbucks probably doesn't want the reputation of just 'nickel and diming' their customers - that's inconsistent with a premium brand experience. McDonalds might charge you for extra pickles (actually I have no idea) but when Starbucks goes that route, it just makes them look bad. You can absorb the cost of "just say yes." If you couldn't, you never would have adopted registered card benefits in the first place.

[Mikey]

This is why I give 90% of my caffeine wanting customers decaf.

And to the real bitches, even if they are asking for decaf, I'll give em caffeine. Sucks for them if they have a heart problem.

I am the drink nazi at my store. You cannot have a doppio macchiato in a grande cup and fill it all with foam. You can have the dollop, but thats it. If you want it all the way up with foam, its a cappucino.

I've explained to customers, "look you want me to fill 12 ounces of that grande cup with foam. where does the foam come from? milk. you can't just have it for free! That be like ordering a sandwich but just asking to pay for the bread! You live in one of the wealthiest neighborhoods in the area, and yet, you are skimping on a few cents. Go ahead, tell my manager. I can't be fired. It's almost impossible to be fired from Starbucks"

I have NO PROBLEM being a dick to customers who are cheap and/or rude. I get my health insurance, and have my other job elsewhere, it has no affect on me.

You can't have a short cup of foam for your little spoiled 3 year old brat.

You can't have a grande cup filled with whip cream you fatty.

You want things, you PAY for it.

Go try saying you want all the luxury items inside your car, but only want to pay for the base model.

People need to take the silver spoon out of the behind.

As long as I'm working, no one gets a free pass.

And I don't care if people hate me for it. So go ahead, complain about me

[Mikey]

Melody, you're the reason why profits are falling. Those 40 cents add up. And two tall cups cost more than one venti cup. Double the whip cream and lids and straws too.

[burntoutbarista]

Wow, I can't believe how riled up people get over this issue!

I think Andrew's description (see above) of Just Say Yes is the best possible take on it. Yes, we allow room for our customers to be particular, and will absolutely give them the cheaper deal if it's a flaw in Starbucks pricing structure (and yes there are many of them) which I think is the case in news article referenced in this thread.

Melody is right when she says nickel and diming the customers will absolutely drive them away. I use JSY with discretion and am at times more nitpicky than some of my coworkers (or even my manager), but I'm not out to screw or mislead the customer. I will always inform my customers of Starbucks standards and let them know why I'm charging them the way I am.

This company is so ambiguous in its communications to both partners and customers that it's almost tiresome to deal with.