Weekend OPEN THREAD: Ask your questions, or just speak your mind

It was a big earnings report week, there was a controversial Starbucks-related "20/20" story aired, and Starbucks slipped on the "Best Companies to Work For" list. Discuss these things, or anything else about Starbucks in the weekend OPEN THREAD. (Keep it civil to avoid being deleted or banned.) || Jump to the second page of comments.

Comments

[Jason Coffee]

What do you think Starbucks needs to do to get back in the Top 20 of the "Best 100 Companies to Work For" list?

Jason Coffee
Coffee Cup News

[Asher]

I don't know that much about the stock market in general, but I thought it was interesting after such a huge profit turned in Q1 we didn't see the spike in the stock price that we saw after the previous two profitable quarters. In fact, it took a pretty good dip the last couple days. Could it be because of the sexual harassment case in California that just went public? Or perhaps it was the 69-place drop from last year on the "100 Best Companies to Work For" list?

I can't imagine the drop has to be sitting well with executives and shareholders alike. I don't know if our leadership is trying to put on a good face or is just that stupid with their cheesy "yay! we made the list!" message on the portal yesterday, but it's hardly something to be proud of. In four years as a SM, we've gone from 2nd on the list, to 7th, to 24th, and now to 93rd. As far as I'm concerned, that tells me there were a lot of other companies that brought their employees through the recession a lot better than Starbucks did.

In regards to getting back into the top 20, I think progress would be made with some re-investment in labor, non-coverage, and partner pay. I also think re-establishing some type of educational environment would help too. Let's face it, we've barely had enough time to take a bathroom break the last year or so, let alone crack out a coffee passport.

The thing is, I don't know if anything now will matter much to the partners who have been here since we were #2 on the list. We remember a company that realized if it took care of it's partners and kept them happy, the partners would make the customers happy and the profit would come. We did what we had to do when the recession hit, and for about six months it was all about accepting the sacrifices. But let's face it, we're still operating on world-ending recession standards. We still have no time to get things done yet the expectations are higher than ever. We've been exposed to cut-throat executive management that will hold us accountable for not meeting expectations, but in actually doing it themselves would be completely lost, hence the DM, RDs and up who say "Figure it out." when you ask how, or wonder what resources are available to you.

So from my perspective, I don't really see how they redeem themselves. I came to Starbucks for something better. Instead all they've shown me is corporate greed, tyranny, and lack of self-accountability. Howard's broken promises have become nothing more than words on a page. I suppose it can be done, but it's going to take awhile. And no matter how many promises are made to the partners this year, I still think we're going to see many, many good partners leave.

[SM FL]

In general the 20/20 story brings up another frustrating issue that I have had to deal with when a minor works in the store. Admittedly, they are minors and so their parents are technically still responsible for them and their well being. However, I can tell you I have received many phone calls of parents calling their son/daughter out of work for the day because they "don't have enough time to finish their homework" or "their grades are slipping".

As a manager who does care about my partners and my business its a difficult position to be put in. No, that's not an acceptable reason to call out ever, and your shift is your responsibility. What probably needs to happen is the minimum hiring age needs to go up to 18 so all partners can be treated like adults.

[s]

"Please do a complete qasa check. The DM may pop by so make sure that everything is spotless. It's probably time to change the water filters. And weve gone over labor so please cut 3 hours of labor today."

[beanboy]

anyone know about that this new coffee passport initiative from corporate that was inspired by the 42day challenge? do you think that this is one step to reinstating coffee master programs?

[Very Sad SM]

SM FL

you have said it better than I could. Here too in MI we are being held to the strictest standards without the labor 'coverage or non coverage' to humanly get it done at all let alone correctly. The labor formula is so pared down & skewed there isnt enough time to even breathe let alone take a lunch...it is not the company it was when we were in the top ten. Oh and better sell some more Via, or your fired....its not fun anymore...

[Very Sad SM]

I meant to send that to Asher, not SM FL oops soory!

[Melody]

@Very Sad SM - The labor situation worries me more than a number of other Starbucks problems. I feel my heart sink a little when I realize that my favorite baristas are working off the clock. I don't always see it right away, and then I realize, "hey wait, she's stocking up the fruit cups in the display case, but not wearing a green apron..." It gets me down. If it happens just once I'm not so alarmed, but I'm now seeing it often enough to feel like that's the wrong kind of store culture.

[coffee in exile]

Any news on the 3 shot in a venti front? I want the larger size but I want the extra espresso that comes free in the 20oz at, you know, every other coffeeshop.

[SBUX Customer]

I just got myself a tumbler from Starbucks. I know that you can take it to Starbucks and refill it with brewed coffee. What else can you fill it with? Can you fill it with hot beverages (cappucinos, lattes, caramel machiato, etc.)? If so, how does the barista measure the right amount for your tumbler? Do they prepare it in a to go cup first and then pour it into the tumbler or do they make the beverage directly in the tumbler? The point is to save paper cups so if they make it in a paper cup first, I will continue use to go cups rather than bring in my own tumbler.

[coffee in exile]

@SBUX Customer: They make it into your tumbler according to the ounce size of the tumbler. They're generally 16oz, but it should be on your tumbler somewhere, or ask the baristas to help you figure it out (pour some hot water in it, measure it into a to-go cup, which is a one time waste that will help you save in the long run).

[Andy, Shift Supervisor, Maryland]

@Melody, although there might be some off-the-clock working going on somewhere in Starbucks land, more likely the partner you saw working without an apron was just him/her not having the extra 6 seconds to put on the green apron.

[Andy, Shift Supervisor, Maryland]

...I agree with the previous posters that more labor would help a lot with problems like this.

[Andy, Shift Supervisor, Maryland]

I'm going to go back to something I've said before, though, that what's really needed is better leadership at the lower levels. No company including Starbucks needs all these layers of management between the customer and the CEO. Get rid of at least 2 of the 4 or so layers of middle management: DM, RDO, RVP, Cliff Burrows. Cutting out completely 2 of those 4 layers would save enough money to pay and attract higher talent for the in-store experience, both to provide it and just to be able to make decisions in the store.

Thoughts?

[SBUX Customer]

@coffee in exile,
Thanks for the quick reply.
I was wondering about the measurement because not all tumblers (non-Starbucks branded) are the standard 12oz (tall) and 16oz (grande). I've seen tumblers that are 14oz. Also, not all tumblers has the oz. printed on it. So some customers could cheat and say their tumbler is a a tall when it is actually a grande and save a little $ plus the $0.10 discount for bringing in your own tumbler. Wasn't sure if Starbucks had a special measuring cup they use for non-to go cups.

[Andy, Shift Supervisor, Maryland]

Let me clarify obviously you can't just fire all the DMs in the country, you'd have to let middle management leave slowly for the most part voluntarily.

[SBUX Alum Bill]

@ Asher:

The Starbucks stock price is about where it should be. The Price:Earnings ratio of the entire S&P 500 is currently just below 20, and Starbucks is giving guidance that Earnings per Share for this fiscal year should be about $1.05. Thus, the expected stock price would be about $21 per share (20 x $1.05). Different companies trade at different PE multiples, because of varying expectations of future profit growth. SBUX stock, though, is pretty much where we would expect it to be.

[john]

I think the firing of assistant managers was a good thing for starbucks because ASM are just overly paid Shift leads, and shift leads need to take more responsibility and i think that will improve things from store to store, as for corporate two things need to change 1. is more labor and 2. more labor thats it, more labor to sell via, more labor to clean, more labor to educate every one on COFFEE, more labor to teach people about espresso machines and maybe well sell some, more labor!!!!!

[spence]

I'll bet she was working off the clock. If you want a good review, you need to do all the list. The only way to complete your tasks is to work off the clock.

[john]

Ive never seen anyone work of the clock,as soon as I clock out the store could burn down for all i care.

[Graylin]

Starbucks grew quickly as a company that challenged convention in it's business model and it's philosophy. Now every single day we're being hammered by corporate on all the things we're not doing right. Stores have to cut labor to the point of military efficiency with military consequences if you can't adhere. They're force feeding us a product that many of our partners don't believe in (yay for VIA!). Starbucks is taking steps backwards as they try to turn themselves from a place where people feel good about working and visiting to a churning profit engine. Funny though, a lot of these measures seem be be backfiring a bit and Howard is busy packing his golden parachute. It's nice to know if the company tanks, Howard will still be sipping lattes, but what about the people who take care of the business? It's very unfortunate that those who care are finding themselves working off the clock or putting their hard earned money back into this company by purchasing VIA instead of stock.

[javagirl666]

I am a VERY tenured SM and I would never expect a partner to work off the clock. If I need to stay late to stock fruit cups, then I stay late. Its not worth it to have a partner injured while working off the clock etc.

[SBUX Customer]

Does Starbucks accept returns without a receipt? I purchased a tumbler with my registered card yesterday. The tumbler would not fit in my water bottle holder because of the rubber grip so I want to exchange for a different tumbler (both the same price). Also the small transparent sticker that says double walled, keeps drinks hotter was removed by me. Another question is, does the tumbler get put back on the shelves, returned to the manufacturer, or do they get thrown away? If they get thrown away then I'll just keep the tumbler instead of having it go to waste.

[sbuxcakes]

No returns w/o a recepit period.

[baristar]

@john you think shift supervisors need to take more responsibilities? They get paid $1/hr. more than a barista. How much more work do you want them to do? (For the record - I went from being a SS back to barista because it wasn't worth it.)

[Jen]

I am a partner who has been with the company for only four months. I work with my best bud and next door neighbor who has worked for the company for close to 4 1/2 years now, and he definately tells me he still loves the company but there are so many changes from the Starbucks it used to be.

My biggest thing isn't the cleaning tasks, or qasa, it's Via. The fact that we get new full-leaf tea is relatively unknown, but yet..we have a $20/day via goal. I hate lying to customers and telling them "Via is fantastic." and i simply have to be as truthful as possible and offer the benefits of "coffee on the go".

I just wish VIA goals would go away, our whole bean and other promotional sales do fantastic, but im sick of shoveling via down people's throats.

[Upset SM]

Couldn't agree more with the Via! When is upper management going to listen to what's going on in the store levels. I don't care too much about the labor (though of course it would be nice to have more). I don't even care about QASA Audits, or Customer Voice, or Values Walks. I can deal with all of that. What I can not deal with is the fact that Via is the #1 thing listed on my performance expectations as a SM. I can not deal with the fact that every phone conversation with my DM starts with ,"so let's talk about via! Are all of your partners asking EVERY customer if they've bought their 3 pack today". I am so sick of it. My partners are sick of it. My customers are sick of it.

I spoke to my DM about 2 weeks ago about my frustrations, and all I got in return was, "Via is here to stay, you're preaching to the choir!".

WHY are they not listening?!?!

[BOSTON STARBUCKS REBEL]

Let's look at labor this way. Let's say that you have 4 meal breaks that need to be taken. Let's say that each person works 15 minutes of that break, without getting paid. That equals an extra hour more of labor. Now let's say that you have six people on that day and they work an extra 10 minutes, without getting paid. Thats another an hour that you get from them combined on the schedule.
Basically, the only way to get things really done in the store these days is to work "off-the-clock" without getting paid for your labor. When you think about that or getting fired its not really that hard of decision. Sure I would like to get paid maybe for those extra two hours I put in every week but I know its not going to happen.

BOSTON STARBUCKS REBEL
PRIMUS INTER PARES
STARBUCKS REBEL ALLIANCE

[BOSTON STARBUCKS REBEL]

BTW that extra un-paid labor if it was included in labor would result in a +4% VTI, which as we all know, unacceptable.

[.]

Free Kind bar samples February 5th? Kind Bars at Starbucks

[Angela]

John, as an ASM that was part of the great 2008 management layoff, I respectfully disagree. I worked as both a SS and then ASM, and I can tell you that ASM's have WAY more responsibilities than a SS. A SS is just like a "key person", they run the floor and hold the keys. But ASM's are part of upper management. They hire and fire people, write schedules, work with the P&L, set and achieve goals, and much more. There is a reason ASM's are salaried and shifts are hourly.

And not all of us got to move on to bigger and better things. I'm back in school now, trying to get into a new career in tourism, but my pay took an 80% cut from my SBUX days.

[Crema]

The triple Venti taste tests resulted in the decision that customers prefer the current double-venti taste profile (I.E. "we don't want to taste the coffee" flavor). Sorry, you'll still have to fork over the +.70 cents.

[waltie]

". But ASM's are part of upper management. They hire and fire people, write schedules, work with the P&L, set and achieve goals, and much more. There is a reason ASM's are salaried and shifts are hourly."

I agree that the ASM position has more responsibilities than the shift supervisor position, but the power to hire and fire partners are not among them. ASMs conduct interviews to be sure, but any actual hiring, corrective actions, and terminations are strictly the responsibility of the SM. ASMs can't ever write people up.

[Doctor's Pepper]

The morale of the Starbucks partners just slipped a lot in the past one to two years. Even though Starbucks was a big company, it felt more personal than other big companies. Now, they require us to sell-sell-sell! They emphasize labor cuts more than ever. I hope they know that one of the most important things to a job is to get paid, and CUT-CUT-CUTTING labor isn't going to help us make money. That's a MAJOR upset to the people who work at Starbucks.

I used to actually feel special and proud to work at Starbucks because it felt like their priority was me. Now, their priorities are different, and all they care about is their profit.

Don't even get started on the VIA. I don't like acting like it's the best thing in the world, and frankly, advertising is good, but OVER-advertising something is annoyance. If Starbucks requires that we ask every customer to buy a VIA and ask them about it EVERY DAY, they are going to stop coming because they don't want to hear it.

[Doctor's Pepper]

How our store tackled the "extra shot in an iced-venti" problem is... we NEVER offer shots. Even when a customer asks for it, we simply tell them, "An iced-venti comes with 3." The idea is to just never offer, so that they will never expect to get a free one.

[I.Heart.Spirit.]

Thank you Doctor's Pepper. I can't stand the fact that certain people in our store ALWAYS offer the extra shot, so now customers always order 'i want the free shot'.

UGH!

[cheapredapron]

Waltie: Actually an ASM can write someone up. It just has to be presented to the partner by the SM.

[(former) FLA SM]

RE: Minors in the workplace. Just because you CAN hire minors doesn't mean you MUST hire minors. The easiest way to avoid all the problems that come with minor employees is to not hire any. I never employed any minors simply for the fact it was too much trouble trying to schedule all the extra mandatory breaks, such as a half hour break after four hours. Unfortunately, there are plenty of unemployed people age 18 or over who will take whatever they can get so I don't see the need to hire minors. (I'm sure there are plenty of former Starbucks employees who were let go when their stores closed that are still looking for work.)

[me myself and I]

Isn't that discriminating against minors, to not hire them?

[me myself and I]

On another note, even though I'm not very happy with the way my store is run, I'm very happy the via madness has gone away.
I haven't heard anything about via in weeks. No pressure whatsoever. This fact alone, compared to what you guys keep telling about the still existent pressure elsewhere, lets me see my SM and DM in a better light. They realized we have a very small but consistent fan base for via (about 50 % of what our official goal is), we still offer it to people that leave a clue they might be into it, but beside that, we don't actively offer it to anyone anymore.

So for once I'm happy to read things here and not being affected at all.

[Melody (reply to Andy in Maryland & Spence)]

She was working off the clock. I wouldn't have posted this if I thought she had just forgotten her green apron. This happened in one of my regular circle of Starbucks stores. I know the barista so I confronted her by name and asked, and she openly told me that she was working off the clock.

[aeiou]

@Melody I've actually experienced the opposite. Where once partners that I worked with were so happy to be at work and help their fellow partners, now people are showing up and leaving shifts exactly on time. Even though we all still like the people we work with, we're less likely to want to think about unfinished tasks off the clock. I know that I used to tidy the store on my break or even when I was just in the store visiting, or I would help other partners out with things if they asked even if I weren't clocked in. I feel like now people have blinders on to the issues in the cafe, for example, when they're on their break because they want to be able to relax when before we were more relaxed on the clock so we weren't as desperate to take what breaks we can get.

[BAYAREABUX]

Anyone feeling pressured to work off the clock should call the Business Conduct Helpline and report the situation.

Don't give Starbucks free labor, or give them the impression that the current labor structuring is working just fine.

[coffee in exile]

@Doctor Pepper: I didn't mean that I wanted people to just give me the shot at Starbucks if I didn't order it (I've worked in a cafe, I so understand how obnoxious people are when they expect free things), I'm saying that at any other coffee shop in our area, a 20oz. hot drink comes with 3 shots; a 24oz iced drink comes with 4 shots, all for the same price or less than Starbucks. It's obnoxious to pay an ungodly high price for one single shot extra to get rid of the distinctly non-coffee flavor of the large beverages.

[Marcus]

W/ re. 2 the # of shots in a venti, it raises the question, is milk cheaper than espresso (to make)?

I've always gotten an iced grande caffe latte solo (one shot) because I like the weaker taste. It makes me notice the sweet caramely, chocolately flavor of the espresso, rather than be overwhelmed by the boldness, plus one shot's worth of caffeine is enough for me. I guess I should get a discount on the drink if the espresso is more expensive than the milk!

[erstwhile]

I'd imagine this is only an issue with stores that still use Verismos.

We almost always offer the extra shot if it's going to go to waste. We just ask the customer, "do you want the second shot, or do you want the fourth shot?"

They're usually very excited about it if they want it, or if they don't, oh well. But we tell them, it's because we pull in pairs, and if we can't use the extra shot for something else, might as well pass it on as a value to the customer. If they ever raise a tizzy about not getting it free in the future, it doesn't take much to be clear with them the circumstance.

(It's also a good way to get people addicted to that extra caffeine so they can start ordering the extra shot and increasing your AT!)

I don't see the big deal. You just have to be careful about how you word it... never tell them "This shot's on the house" because you can upset the next customer in line if they don't get the same offer.

As for working off the clock...stores with a tight-knit crew tend to look out for each other. If I walked into my store and there were two partners on the floor getting slammed and on the verge of tears/angry outrages/whatever, you bet your butt I'd jump in and lend a hand for a second. To reiterate BSR's post, sometimes it's easier to fudge the rules than deal with the lesser-desirable consequences of actually following the rules.

[Karl Dahlquist ~ karldotcom]

Extra shots and Off the Clock...

I usually order an Iced Venti Latte and about half the time the barista will ask if I want "the extra shot" Since the Verismo machines pour double-shots they have to make four shots for a three shot drink anyway.

I watched this process a couple times before asking about it, and was told it was more consistent to pull two shots at once than a single shot. So, then I asked "Do you really dump the extra shot every time someone orders a 3 shot drink?" and the barista said "yeah...but were not supposed to let anyone know." Then the shift supervisor said "You aren't supposed to talk about that."

I have also come across Starbucks Partners working off-clock. Most notably, one was working toward a Black Apron and making French Presses....I stuck around for a while and sampled three different blends, and some of the different cakes along with hit. (Who am I to turn down free coffee?)

It was kind of humorous as she kept putting the used cups, presses and plates in the sink and said "Oh, they will wash it" pointing to the Partners actually on-the-clock. (and they did)

This all occured when the manager was off for a week...so I dont know if she knew about it or not.

[coffee in exile]

@Marcus: Hahahahaha, milk is quite a bit more expensive than espresso.

[me myself and I]

At my store we only offer the extra shot if we don't have another drink in line we could use it for. Yes, sometimes people even order it the "tall with the free extra shot latte", but if they do that we just very politely explain to them it depends on the lineup if they can have it or not. If they want to make sure to get it, they will have to pay for it. Otherwise it's up to the actual barista and his organization of the bar.

[Marcus]

So, if the espresso is cheaper than milk, then it stands to reason that Starbucks should welcome adding more espresso and less milk to its drinks. Personally, I'd rather have the milk!