OPEN THREAD conversation-starter: What are your thoughts on self-serve brew coffee stations?

I've used the self-serve drip coffee counter at the Merchandise Mart Starbucks in Chicago, and it seemed fine. You pay the barista, he/she hands you a cup, and you proceed to the self-serve counter for your coffee. Simple enough. (Read about the self-serve test here.) Any comments from Merchandise Mart baristas, or employees at other self-serve stores? Discuss this, or anything else Starbucks-related in the weekend open thread.

Comments

[Sheik]

I know - everyone - is clumsy at times but I can just see the large amount of messes due to spilled coffee caused by customers.......

[z]

sweet, so now it's not only mcdonalds- it's mcdonalds with a cafeteria. that is directly opposite in direction of establishing that you're about quality coffee- that's saying that the coffee doesn't even matter enough for us to get it for you.

[Aengus]

Do we need to tip them for handing us a cup?

[SamlltownSM]

I worked at this store 3 years ago before transfering out of Chicago. We had the self serve coffee station then, so it's nothing really new. Back then, the customers almost demanded it. There was talk of taking it away, and the customers were against it. Honestly, it really doesn't hurt the customer experience, because the customers still wait in line, and this store has always done a great job of know every customer, even if they just got brewed coffee every day.
I don't think it's a good move to put this in every store, but this is a Cafe Store that consistently has a line atleast 20 customers deep continuely for a few hours in the morning and then again at lunch time.
And the messes weren't that bad. We had a floater commited completely to Brewing coffee, cafe checks, restocking the station, and this person was running all shift.
And you didn't need to tip, but a lot of customers would just hand the expeditor cash, exact or not, and tell us to keep the change and we would ring them in during breaks in the rush. So even though it wasn't expected, a lot of our drip customers still did.
I miss this store so much, and the Manager helped shape me into a great Partner.

So, this is one of the new big things Howard has decided on?

"Sure, let's keep on charging MORE for the coffee (of which the quality is decreasing) and now you can do half the work for yourself!"

Give me part of the barista's pay and I'll pour my own coffee. Otherwise, don't bother. This is so ridiculous.

Again, Starbucks needs to learn what a service-industry company is. It's not making your customers provide the service to themselves.

Where does anyone in this company come off thinking this is okay? Entitlement all around, once again.

Sad.

[darthsid]

Customers making messes, cheapskate ones draining the brewers the second a fresh batch goes in, customers complaining about quality, customers complaining about not enough coffee, the list goes on...

Hell on earth, anyone?

[dzippy]

Our store has a self-serve brew station. Our dedicated brew position and their float helper are running around for the entire rush, making sure everything gets done. The last thing you can infer in this situation is that we sit back and make the customer do all the work.If it's not busy and you think you've paid enough to have someone else pour your coffee, sure I'll 'just say yes'. When the line is out the door and we ring 100 transactions per till in half an hour - you can pour your own 2/3 bold, 1/6 decaf, 1/8 mild, with room for 'sloshing around' at the top, coffee. I'm kidding here, but is it so bad to make your coffee exactly like you want it instead of having someone else do it (possibly incorrectly)?

[TDotSM]

I worked at a self-serve store in Toronto. It's a concept store for high volume areas. Howard Schultz visited it, and said there would never be one like it again as he doesn't think it has the 3rd Place appeal of the other stores.
This one was at the junction of the subway lines, and would do over 180 people in 30 mins....the customers there just wanted fast and it is!!!

[Meag]

Well in BC that I know of we dont have any of those? Even as cool as it sounds.. doesn't it just reinforce the notion that the company and Howard sre losing their touch? I mean with self-serve equip. doesn't it defeat the purpose of connecting, discovering and responding to our customers? If more stores end up with these things won't we become just another self-serving "fast food" place? It could very well be demanded by customers who're looking ot be independent..yet I think there'll be more negative consequences than good ones =/

[Meag]

sorry about the spelling mistakes, Im kinda tired lol

[Yes]

That sounds like a great idea to me, because being a partner, all we ever make are frappuccinos anyway. Plus when they run out of coffee, we can just say " Oh, its empty? Ill brew you another one ". I dont care, the only thing I would really like to see, is Howard say, " Ok, you guys can wear Converse, as long as they are black! ".

[pdx_barista]

If any of you read the mystarbucksidea site, click on ideas in action. A lot of people are asking for ways to get people who only want drip coffee through the line faster. Two lines is a plausible idea, although most stores are not built for two lines to function well. So this is another idea they are trying. But there's always going to be people who gripe about whatever decision Starbucks makes. Can't make everyone happy.

[Corgi]

LIke anything in life, timing is everything. If the SBUX stock is doing great and the company is enjoying positive press, this can be a great idea at some locations. At least people will be more inclined to try something different. But now is not the right timing to introduce something like this. Customers go up in arms about pouring their own coffee, looking for more negative things to criticize SBUX. Idea shot dead before it even gets a chance.

Also, how do you distinguish this "self serve brew station" from 7-Eleven? You can't just stick a coffee shuttle on the counter and call it good. Talk about big messes - some people are messy enough to begin with. How many times do you see stir sticks, sugar packs, straw wrappers, left right ON the counter - when the garbage can is actually 3 inches from the mess? Why not throw them IN the garbage can!? Why leave them ON the counter? These behaviors simply baffle me, and yes, it is inconvenient to me as a customer. Putting the coffee on the counter is easy; keeping it clean and hazard-free is not. Can you hear "lawsuits"? "Burnt by Starbucks hot coffee at the self-serve station!" Pppfffttt!

[josh hagquist]

i think there should be a website dedicated to venting about all the horrible little indie coffee shops out there. paying their peons minimum wage without benefits...but wait, they are "cool" and because they aren't starbucks their coffee is "great". maybe some of the people here should work on "organizing" those poor noble souls who choose to work for stores that don't provide anything beyond a paycheck? but ultimately starbucks will always be "the bad guy"...whatever they do will be scrutinized and questioned. the corporation is accused of everything under the sun...evil evil starbucks...

the amount of vitriol people have towards starbucks is off-the-charts insane.

i love my job. i love working for starbucks. i appreciate my benefits and my stock and my 401k.

[I appreciate the barista]

I would not really like the self-service station. I have had some wonderful chats with the baristas. If a self-service station, why not just have a slot for your card, let you pick the size and have the right cup come out, have it fill your drink like the old coffee vending machines? Ick! Starbucks is in the people biz.

@aengus - the real question is whether you tip them (you actually never NEED to tip them) for pouring you a coffee...that's it, nothing else? I see some modicum of labor as inherent in the price I pay. I know for me, taking my order, grabbing a cup, filling it by tugging on a little handle, and putting on the lid are inherent in the price. I almost exclusively get brewed coffee. I drop a buck in every so often, once or twice a week, because the people at my store are WONDERFUL human beings and mostly local college students. If my store had self serve, I would tip for the the brewed coffee the same way.

[Sarah]

Lately, if I'm just getting "regular" coffee, I'll drive through McDonalds. Because it's 2 dollars cheaper and I like the milder (aka, not burnt) taste a lot more. But I think that when I *am* getting plain ol' coffee in a Starbucks, I'd like to get it at one of these stations. It'd be nice to not need to wait behind the person ordering a tripledipple extra blah blah sugar free yadayada no-whip caramel on the cup WhoHa.

[itsnotamermaid]

well, this would make us more like other coffee shops--i can't think of a coffee shop, aside from Peet's and Coffee Bean and Tea Leaf, where you don't pour your own drip coffee. oh and DTs. i know there would be some difficulty setting this up in my store as the physical layout would make it tricky. sounds like self-serve coffee stations work in other stores/locations tho, especially with having a partner or two dedicated to the self-serve area.

[Sarah]

Oh, and, off topic, but:
I had a lovely experience at the Starbucks in Northbrook, IL...the one near the Container Store and Trader Joes. It was a lovely cappucino, and your smile and lesson in "Bux-ese" was appreciated and made my day. Thanks!

[I appreciate the barista]

@sarah, where is your mcdonalds, I want to find out where I can get paid to drink coffee. I can get a venti @ starbucks and STILL pay less than 2 dollars. I typically only get a tall and on occasion, a grande.

[Bladerunner]

Many morning customer don't care if their coffee is 30 mins old or 55 mins old. They just want their coffee NOW, and don't want to wait for it. Now I'm being asked to make new coffee every 30 mins! Is Seattle Crazy!!!!! Only if we have a 3rd person on the floor all morning long. Which means a 4th for breaks and paperwork. And if we have more labor, that would be a Tuesday suprise. Don't ask me to do more, really, don't. I can't ring cash, get pastries, warm sandwiches, and make coffee every 30 mins. I feel like a spinning frekin top now! And a self serve station...well it just another mess to clean up after...

[waltie]

They are going to increase labor to adjust for the changes to COW. Don't panic. Having to rebrew coffee once everyy thirty minutes is going to be easy.

[waltie]

I agree with the sentiments expressed by Josh.

My sister is another one of those people who despises Starbucks because they are pure evil and drive companies out of business and treat people like slaves. She complains about Starbucks whenever I see her, refuses to go to one, and instead only frequents "independent" coffee shops.

When I try to tell her how many of my coworkers had to quit those independent shops because they didn't make a living wage, can't afford insurance, and have no sense of security or hope for advancement, she doesn't listen. Because she's crazy.

[StLouieDrip]

"... and a machine called the Clover that makes premium drip coffee."

I've seen this so many times... is anybody else irked by these journalists who say/write that the Clover makes "drip coffee"? Or is an upside down French press technically considered a "drip" process? But somehow I don't think these journalists are informed enough (or care enough) to be aware of the "technical" differences between an upside down press vs traditional drip. And no matter how I look at it, I'm not able to regard PRESSED coffee as being in the same category as DRIP coffee.

[Dog MONKEY]

I can make myself espresso / coffee / smoothies at home. I don't want to do it when I'm out.

If I'm paying for something, I expect the preparation to be done for me. Sorry, not buying this 'do it yourself' approach. Again, save that for the home.

(I'm similarly unenthusiastic regarding the whole 'make your own meals for the week' places. Sorry, again, if I want to make my meals for the week, I'll go to the grocery store and prepare at home. If I go out, I expect someone else to handle the preparation)

Consumers, do NOT encourage/endorse this growing trend of shifting labor to the end-user.

'Do we need to tip them for handing us a cup?'

...nobody NEEDS to tip anyone for anything. Perhaps instead of complaining about it, just stop doing it. Problem solved.

[PatOldStarbucksCustomer]

The reason I quit going to Starbucks:

Late 2006/ early 2007 Starbucks announced a price hike of 10 to 15 cents a cup for everything. That same week, CEO gets a multi-million dollar bonus. Do the math - I'm paying for CEO's bonus - NOT!!

Still slip in for an occasional molasses cookie, but that is all.

[funky latte]

Oh my God More work and little pay even as a s.s. Aren't we stretched just a little bit than we need these days? I thought partners were important to this company! Oh B.S. I think it's tiome to open up my own coffee shop and thanks Howie for all you have taught me I will take these skills and use them wisely and not make the stupid mistakes you have made.

Many morning customer don't care if their coffee is 30 mins old or 55 mins old. They just want their coffee NOW, and don't want to wait for it. Now I'm being asked to make new coffee every 30 mins! Is Seattle Crazy!!!!! Only if we have a 3rd person on the floor all morning long. Which means a 4th for breaks and paperwork. And if we have more labor, that would be a Tuesday suprise. Don't ask me to do more, really, don't. I can't ring cash, get pastries, warm sandwiches, and make coffee every 30 mins. I feel like a spinning frekin top now! And a self serve station...well it just another mess to clean up after...

Posted by: Bladerunner | Apr 5, 2008 10:36:48 AM

Then you will be out of a job. Frankly, I despise the DIY initative as much as any paying customer should, but if your company says you'll do X, then you'll do X.

If you cannot meet your job requirements, then you don't have a job.

You're there voluntarily. You can leave and find a job where you're more apt to do the required tasks at hand.

If Starbucks says that you'll clean the toilets with your apron, then you'd better get in there!

Oh, service-industry workers seem so entitled these days.

Apr 5, 2008 1:08:04 PM

SHAME ON YOU!

[13YearCustomer]

I wouldn't mind it, but it feels it's another decision that takes the shine off the atmosphere.

"Lately, if I'm just getting "regular" coffee, I'll drive through McDonalds. Because it's 2 dollars cheaper"

Really??? It's $2 cheaper? Then you must be coffee for free at McDonald's. The venti drip coffee is $2.07 with tax. You're comparing lattes to drip coffee... BIG difference. And Starbucks does offer milder coffees... Just ask! If you prefer McDonald's, that's fine. But it's not $2 cheaper.

"Really??? It's $2 cheaper? Then you must be coffee for free at McDonald's"

LOL

[question]

I apologize in advance for the question, but I'm not understanding what is "hard" about making fresh coffee every 30 minutes. I see from previous comments that your job is very hectic with many responsibilities why not consider this one more?

[sbuxnewbie]

Just had a mini-training session with a partner yesterday, who wasn't able to come in for the information on the new brewing procedure, and thus didn't get the scoop on Pike Place Roast.

She isn't much of a coffee drinker, only likes a couple of the milder blends, and then with a lot of cream and sugar.

So we did a french press of the Pike Place Roast, and had her try it.

She liked it, and just as importantly, she liked it black!

The more I try it,the more I like it, too.

Now, if only they had the t-shirts in XXL, since I'm opening on Tuesday, and we don't have one my size....

Now, if only they had the t-shirts in XXL, since I'm opening on Tuesday, and we don't have one my size....

My God.

[Shannun]

I think the 30 minute hold time for coffee is a great idea! I have no problem throwing out old coffee, the taste is so much fresher. Fresh brewed coffee in the morning and all day should have always been a priority. Circle k Gas stops have had the same standards for years. Fresh coffee every thirty minutes. If people working with customers wanting cigarettes and gas can change 6 different pots of coffee throughout the day I think three Baristas can find time to set a timer and brew, then pour out old coffee... Its just three pots every thirty minutes. We must stay on our toes!

[Shannun]

Also
I think the self serve coffee station is a crazy Idea.
Of course I only get a few people who ask for the 3/4 Colombia and a splash of decaf house with a quarter inch of room...
I think it would be too much to take care of,
The milk spills are enough for me >.<;;.
The extra coffee "accidentally" spills into my splenda holder too much... To think of coffee al over the dining floor

[diana]

I'm a die-hard Starbucks fan from the beginning... (at least in Georgia anyway).
This is possibly the worst idea I've heard so far.
Get back to where you were.
Service is everything— after the coffee experience, that is.

We can go to plenty of other self service places.
If thatr's what the customer wanted, we'd already be there.

And, while you're at it, ditch the food except that which you originally started with: cookies, pastry, muffins and interesting dessert bars.

Unless you intend to completely change the presetnation, counters and serivce capabilties...it's simply not working and only interferes with the original concept.
Most sincerely

[Torontodude]

Comparing Starbucks to indy places seems to be a recurring theme of this site.

I frequent both. They offer different experiences.

What Starbucks offers is consistency. You know you will get a good (but maybe not great) cup of coffee along with a comfortable place to spend some time. There is also an excellent chance the barista will at least attempt to make some sort of connection with you.

I also go to two of the best indy places in town. The coffee is generally better. The price is about the same. But whether the overall experience is better is a closer call.

Funky/indy place #1:
Great coffee, but it offers only espresso drinks. There is no drip coffee. Instead, the baristas drip "attitude." There is also no menu board. But there is a bit of a "soup Nazi" vibe to how you are supposed to order and pay. An ever-changing cast of angst-ridden baristas, shabbily clad in black, avoid eye contact as they kvetch out the drinks -- but only to the worthy. The americanos cost only $2.00. A custom drink that is mid way between a latte and a a capuccino is $3. Yummy home made muffins cost just $1. There is no extra charge for the existensial despair that comes along with the bad art on the wall and the calculated rudeness of the staff.

Indy place #2:
Excellent service and superb coffee. They roast on the premises and grind each cup to order. Very friendly. But it seems to be a low volume place. I've never been there during a rush, and wonder if they could hope.

[Kelly]

I think this is a great idea. It will speed up the lines in busier locations.

This idea isn't new. Panera and Bigby (former Beaners) have done this for years. It frees up the barista for the more complicated orders.

[Shannun]

Bah, complicated orders is what we do :D
Pouring coffee is the easy part I enjoy:D

[triple_short]

to those that say indie coffee shops do not offer a living wage:

i just want to say that a lot of indie coffee shops in seattle do offer their employees benefits (at least medical benefits), and they make more tips per hour on average than i make at starbucks (we get about $2.25 an hour on a good week).

in addition, with what i make now at starbucks as a shift supervisor, i cannot live on my own. i live with my parents and would be unable to afford rent, bills, car insurance, gas and food in the seattle area. which is why i am waiting on going into the RMT program where i can actually make enough money to live.

starbucks is great, but they definitely make you wait in order to get what we call a "living wage". if you stay a barista, forget it.

[Derek]

I have a question.

My manager recently told me that they can tell if I give out free drinks ( and I don't except of course a surprise and delight once in a while). She also told me that I'm not allowed to give out free drinks without a shift or a manager's approval... I wasn't sure since she's an outside hire and VERY new at our store (and any store for that matter)

So 1) Is it possible to monitor how many free drinks I give out? That seems like a lie to me

and 2) What's our policy with giving out free drinks?

"I apologize in advance for the question, but I'm not understanding what is "hard" about making fresh coffee every 30 minutes. I see from previous comments that your job is very hectic with many responsibilities why not consider this one more?"

It's hard because sometimes there are only two people behind the counter with a long line going on indefinitely.

Employee1 is: preparing espresso beverages, iced teas and coffee and frappacinos.

Employee2 is ringing, writing cups, getting pastries, answering customer questions, pouring drip coffee, making hot tea, and changing out coffee every 10 minutes!! (altenating mild, bold and decaf).

You can add all kinds of variable... hey can you sample", "hey, the bathroom needs...", "you need more cream", "can I get 3 Venti waters"?!
"the trash is overflowing", phone ringing, Joe-to-go's.

Believe me, you have no idea how good these guys are. I'm sure if they were not so overextended the service would be much improved.

Regarding self serve:

I can't see how this would be positive unless it gave them speedier service. Which does not seem realistic.

How emabarrasing would it be to have them wait in line for a few minutes, then order and pay just to have an employee say "here's your cup stand behind the others at the condiment bar and sel-serve". :/

[K]

I attended the Starbucks meeting about the big suprise launch on tuesday. They mentioned nothing about self serve coffee... Perhaps i missed it but that definately was not our focous.

[Joe B]

THEN WHAT WAS IT?!?!?!?? AARRRRRRRGLE.

[maggiemunkee]

anonymous at 5:55:16,

amen to that! luckily my store manager is getting much better about that. :) happier in the morning when i don't want die.

[Me]

Derek, the answer is: it depends.
Do you ring the free drinks in, the way you are supposed to do to keep inventory in order?
If yes, your manager can track it in the system.
If not, it's considered to be theft.

And as far as I was told everyone can decide on the spot if it is appropriate to give away a free drink. This is what starbucks understands as customer service. You have the power to decide on the spot if this is what it takes to make this customer in front of you a happy, returning (and then paying) custumer. At least this is what I was told.

Probably the problem in your store might be too many baristas give away too many drinks to their friends and this is why your store manager decided you guys need a managers approval to give away free drinks.

This should have nothing to do with internal or external hire. Even though the externals need a little longer to get into the whole starbucks philosophy thing.

Oh and if your store has cameras, maybe she just watches you giving out too many free drinks to your friends. Thought of that?

[Melody]

I'm with 13yearcustomer: it does take the romance and shine off of Starbucks a bit. I hope that this does not get implemented universally.

Derek, as for free drinks: As an avid customer, what I hear is that you really should charge for every little thing. I've been told by one barista that giving out free drinks is grounds for immediate dismissal. Having said that, I notice that at the Starbucks stores where I'm a regular, I do end up with a lot of free beverages. Mostly, many baristas who see you all the time will fill up a tumbler with drip coffee and not charge you. I'm not saying that happens all the time, but the most common pattern that I observe is that I get a "now and then free drip" - I think it's a make-shift loyalty rewards program in action. ;) ;)