Independent coffee shops in Seattle no longer fear Starbucks

While they respect much of what Starbucks has done, independents have learned not to fear it, reports Melissa Allison. "These small, nimble competitors don't struggle with the high overhead costs and glaring global scrutiny that besets Starbucks. Unlike independents up against a big retailer like Wal-Mart, they often thrive when Starbucks is nearby." Not only in Seattle, but around the country. || Starbucks no longer gives small coffee shops the jitters

Comments

[Matt]

The only "non-starbucks" coffee shop in my area is Caribou Coffee :)

[Richard]

I've visited Caribou once while visiting Chicago. It be nice to have one in my area.

[Cali ASM]

Well it's been great posting here. I have to quit Starbucks. My husband and I are moving next month and there's no Starbucks in our new town (can you believe that!).

I'll miss everyone. Good luck to you all.

[Decaf Drinker]

We have quite a few small shops in our area, but I've never visited any of them. Outside of Chicago, been to Caribou and don't care for it - so my loyalty still lies with Starbucks.

[P.R.I.D.E.]

I can't say it is the same for independants around my area- but then again I'm in a place that has been the hardest hit by foreclosures, etc in the country. I've seen one particular building now go through two coffee shops- open for 3 months then close down, to sell to another enterprenuer, to open for a few months then close their doors...I think Seattle is a great place for coffee, period. So dreary, dark, and rainy all the time.

[Melody]

PRIDE, today is August 20, and it is 65 degrees, and I just got soaked from rain doing errands downtown. Any coffee shop can thrive in Seattle. There's plenty of business for everyone because it has got to be one of the few cities where hot drip coffee is wonderful almost everyday of the year!

[Darleen]

Cali ASM,
Well you see how things always have a way of working out? You were on the fence about sbux for so long and now your decision has been made for you. Hard to believe there isn't a sbux near you huh? On to bigger and better things! I wish you all the luck in the world, just because you don't work for sbux doesn't mean you can't post here, half the folks who post are customers just like you and me now. Keep in touch and let us know what's happening with your life ok? Best of luck to you!

[sample cup]

ha!

[Ken]

I think a lot of folks make the mistake of thinking "indie is better". Its not always the case, but not trying an indie becuase you like starbucks would be like not going to a small family owned italian resturant becuase you like Olive Garden.

[Andy]

I've been to good indies and I've been to bad indies. Likewise, I have been to good Starbucks and to not-so-good Starbucks (like the one where I stuck to the floor - ewww).

There are things I'd like to see Starbucks do better. When I lived in St. Louis (pre-too many Starbucks down there) I was a block away from Kaldi's. This place roasted their coffee locally and had (if I remember correctly) 5 coffees brewing at any point. While I drink PPR, I'd rather have a bold offering in the PM.

That being said, Starbucks does quite well for a large chain. I almost always get enthusiastic service no matter which location I stop at and the baristas usually do a good job making the drinks. So, I'd say that for me Starbucks is a consistent brand. Yes, you can find some good indies out there, but you have to know where to look.

[Torontodude]

The best of the indies offerl better coffee than Starbucks.

But the overall experience can fall short. Mismatched and broken furniture scattered randomly on a scarred wooden floor that hasn't been swept lately -- well, it's not everyone's idea of "atmosphere." Nor are tatooed employees unacquainted with razors or clean clothes who drip "attitude" along with the coffee.

Starbucks offers pretty good coffee and a standardized atmosphere. Many people like that. Employees, in general, are far superior to those found elsewhere in retail.

Just a couple of days ago, I was at one of Toronto's leading
indie micro roasters. My drip coffee was lukewarm. I don't think that would happened at Starbucks. OTOH, my americano was outstanding. And so was the pound of Ethiopian whole beans I bought.

Starbucks and Indies each have their strengths and weaknesses. It's not a case of either/or.

[toronto sbux worker]

mercury, darkhorse, or manic for good espresso. starbucks for convenience or place to study :)

[Torontodude]

Jet Fuel on Parliament and The Remarkable Bean in The Beach are my Toronto Indie favorites. Jet Fuel is just around the corner from me, and a new Starbucks is under construction
across the street. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

And if you call yourself a "Starbcuks worker" (rather than a barista) I guess yio haven't drunk the koolaid -- so to speak.

[casey]

just off-subject here but would like to share this with you guys. I work at Sbux and a corporate store is closing in my town and the DL is going around the other 2 Sbux in her district and threatening to fire peole randomly with no previous write-ups or anything...We think she's trying to make room for the 15 or so affected partners at the store which is closing...she wants them transferred to our store and the other one so she needs to make room...I think this is very shady on Sbux's part...any thoughts???

[Cut Out The Heart]

Casey,

Desperate measures for desperate people. Tell your partners to go to a local shop to get a job. One thing I know is that Starbucks does train well which means an independent will do well by hiring an ex-Starbucks person.

[Thierry]

What's interesting is that a few people in the UK have left Starbucks recently and are now working with a TV celebrity chef spying on our newly launched store. Pick up the phone

[Darleen]

Casey,
That is so sad to hear. I mean it, who can work efficiently with the cloud of unemployment hanging over their head? Stores that once were filled with enthusiastic partners are now filled with partners that are afraid to do anything above and beyond their job description. My advice is just keep doing what is in the best interest of the customers. Let them know they are your main focus and don't dwell on one DM who obviously doesn't get it.

[StLouieDrip]

Torontodude: The best of the indies offerl better coffee than Starbucks.

But the overall experience can fall short. Mismatched and broken furniture scattered randomly on a scarred wooden floor that hasn't been swept lately -- well, it's not everyone's idea of "atmosphere." Nor are tatooed employees unacquainted with razors or clean clothes who drip "attitude" along with the coffee.

Heyyy, we have an indy like that, LOL. Meshuggah Coffee House. (Ya see, they even put it in their name, ha.) They seem to be quite proud of their scratched, chipped and mix-matched furniture, missing chairs, and scrungy-grungy décor. I once saw a plant growing out of an old beat-up cowboy boot... NOT pretty. But the employees are friendly, polite, and seem to appreciate hygiene despite their tattoos. And the americanos will curl your toes, mmmm. Meshuggah doesn't do drip, only espresso. But I do think they use that weird atmosphere as a way to control the customer numbers. Because their espresso is so good there's just no way they could manage the ensuing crowd if they ever decided to spruce up the place.

Andy: When I lived in St. Louis (pre-too many Starbucks down there) I was a block away from Kaldi's.

Kaldi's, ahh yes. They used to be my long-ago standby when they had only one location. Now they have 3 stores in this area, (and another one in Springfield, MO). Yes, it's definitely time to get reacquainted!

[Torontodude]

Meshugah sounds a lot like Jet Fuel. It regularly makes the list of best coffee houses in town -- AND the worst coffee houses in town. That's because there is a bit of a Seinfeldesque "soup Nazi" vibe to the place.

Not only does Jet Fuel serve no drip coffee -- there is no menu. Newbies are NOT welcome. There seems to be a hipness test. Not everyone passes. Staff is nice enough -- once they know you. But this can take months. In the meantime, customers are left guessing on what, when and how to order, pick up, and pay.

They have a very loyal neighborhood clientele of artsy-fartsy types. Lots of supposed poets and novelists tap away on laptops. Bad art adorns the walls. Jet Fuel is also a "biker bar" that sponsors a cycling team.

Each drink is hand-crafted and high qualitty. Dopios, machiattos, and americanos are just $2. Capucinnos and lattes are just $3. A weird cap/latte hybrid called a Jet Fuel is also $3. Home made muffins are just $1.

I think part of the "attitude" schtick is intended to keep out the riff raff from the Tom Horton's a few doors away. When the Starbucks opens across the street, it may end up drawing more customers form Tim's than Jet Fuel. It's a very mixed neighborhood with tens of thousands of welfare recipients, along with affluent professionals, professors, etc... who own homes.

But some of those professionals are exasperated at the Jet Fuel scene, and might welcome a Starbucks where everyone gets a smile. It's hard to predict. I really wonder.

[StLouieDrip]

OMG, Meshuggah is like Jet Fuel in some ways, but not so much in others. Meshuggah is way cool, nice. Lots of staff and customers are a little bit odd in a wide variety of ways, but also lots who are just normal. Meshuggah has been rated best for coffee, and also rated the friendliness coffee shop in town. The regulars have a real strong affection for that place. And newbies are also cool with everybody, and treated kindly. Even uncool people are cool. There is really no attitude, and no test, just a lot of nice oddball and normal people hanging out. But your description of the Jet Fuel neighborhood fits with Meshuggah, a mix of artsy-fartsy, affluence, indigent, homeless, yes, all of that. Some say Meshuggah's name (Yiddish for "crazy") accurately reflects the mishmash of the neighborhood.

It's just that the owner of Meshuggah seems to have a special affection for a "meshuggah" décor, truly off the wall. And he's nice enough as far as I've been able to tell, just not a suck-up, and not interested in being a gazillionaire, so he doesn't try to woo customers with pretty stuff or sbux's style of overly friendliness. I certainly don't get the soup nazi vibe from him, quite the opposite. And regarding the drip, after you've had their americano you really could care less that they don't serve drip, haha. The nearby sbux is 2-3 short blocks away and also does a very nice business. It's probably a godsend for those who want the sbux tradition, (so I expect there are some near Jet Fuel who would also welcome a sbux). But once you've had Meshuggah it's difficult to go back to sbux. In the end both of them have their staunchly loyal customers.

But Jet Fuel sounds scary, LOL. I tend to stutter and get confused, even when I know exactly what I want, so I probably wouldn't pass the test, LOL. But I really do like that name, Jet Fuel, haha.

[Torontodude]

If you're really interested in more, google "jet fuel" coffee Toronto.

But I'll leave you with this comment from a poster on another site:

"The amazing thing is, even though I've been there three or four times and hated it so much that I actually took the time to write this post, there's a considerable part of me that actually wants to go back and be accepted into the coffee clique. Is Jet Fuel's marketing scheme being so unwelcoming to new clientele that you'll do anything to fit in?

The more rational part of my mind says that high school is over. I'd rather be president of the AV Club than Prom Queen."

[Torontodude]

If you're really interested in more, google "jet fuel" coffee Toronto.

But I'll leave you with this comment from a poster on another site:

"The amazing thing is, even though I've been there three or four times and hated it so much that I actually took the time to write this post, there's a considerable part of me that actually wants to go back and be accepted into the coffee clique. Is Jet Fuel's marketing scheme being so unwelcoming to new clientele that you'll do anything to fit in?

The more rational part of my mind says that high school is over. I'd rather be president of the AV Club than Prom Queen."

[StLouieDrip]

I also thought of that while I was reading your earlier posts, that there is a certain odd appeal for some people who need to pass a test in order to be allowed into the clique. Being rejected makes them feel even more attracted to Jet Fuel. And then finally being accepted makes that acceptance feel even more valuable to them. And I agree, it seems highschool-ish in many ways.

I'm simply not interested in anyone's approval, at least not in that way. And I'm not a clique-ish person at all. I seek out premium coffee because I genuinely adore the taste of premium coffee, not because I'm trying to establish my self-worth by being accepted into the Premium Coffee Club. And I would venture to say that Meshuggah probably appeals mostly to the types of people who don't like/need cliquish clubs. Or maybe it's a hangout for the non-cliquey cliques? In any case no one would ever mistake it as a place to get an ego boost. LOL

[kittyhoney712]

Forget about cliques. Who cares? This is coffee we are drinking.
I am a longtime So Cal Starbucks fan who has steadily watched the Baristas get lazier, the shots left out for minutes (!)
and the drinks become more like candy and less like coffee. I am living in Australia now where Starbucks is just another coffeehouse. You can find great coffee in a number of places(22 places for espresso in my local mall for example), where baristas have competitions and the shots are treated with care. If you are all about being social and having some drip, go to Denny's or McDonalds or your local bar.
If you want a good shot and a well made drink, go to a place that takes pride in their coffee making skills, OR complain to your local Starbucks that its quality has gone downhill. Its a shame.

[TORONTOWYLD]

Torontodude, your posts have inspired me to drop in and give Jet Fuel a try next time I'm nearby (I live just outside Cabbagetown and am in the area regularly to fishgaze at Menagerie), and now I'll have to be curious and see what I can find out about who'll be managing that new 'bux accross the street too =>

[Torontodude]

TorontoWyld:

Sounds like fun. Please report back on your Jet Fuel experience. I could offer tips on how to comport yourself, but it will be more interesting to see what happens to you as a newbie.

[TORONTOWYLD]

I'm almost tempted to deliberately try ordering as gauchely as possible and waltz in wearing as styleless an outfit I can muster just to mess with 'em ;>
(like the huge baggy sweatpants and white ribbed tank top I'm lounging around the house in right now)

Though now my mind's wandering towards treating one of the gals at Pet Valu to a 'bux drink once they're open 'cause she used to work in a downtown store but it was way too busy for her sanity...

[KimKM]

I find it interesting that Decaf Drinker (and I'm sure several others over the continent) believe that Seattle is dark and dreary, dare I say, a majority of the time. If you haven't been there, you are most certainly missing out. Yes, they get their fair share of rain, but that fair share of rain brings the lushest scenery. And when the sun is out, a person can understand why some call that area the Emerald City. Go check it out sometime!! And make sure to hit Pike Place Market. ( www.pikeplacemarket.org )

[Torontodude]

You can never be too badly dressed for Jet Fuel. Trust me on this.

As for ordering: try asking for a "regular" coffee and seen what happens. Or try asking "what kind of coffee do you have?" --
not unreasonable given the absence of a menu -- and watch for madcap hijinks to ensue.

As for HOW and WHEN to order or pay -- my lips are sealed

[CafeHunt]

Sounds like fun. Please report back on your Jet Fuel experience. I could offer tips on how to comport yourself, but it will be more interesting to see what happens to you as a newbie. Check out http://www.cafehunt.com for independent coffee shops all around.

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While they respect much of what Starbucks has done, independents have learned not to fear it, reports Melissa Allison.