Maybe it's just as well people don't know that Starbucks runs 15th Avenue Coffee and Tea

THE COMFY CHAIR

By "JUAN VALDEZ"

Starbucks
328 15th Ave
Seattle

Instead of doing our usual Starbucks thing, the burro decided he wanted something different...perhaps try a real, down-home local, non-chain type coffeeshop where the ambiance drips like melted butter and everyone knows your name.

So, one bright sunny Seattle afternoon, we hoofed off to a new place on 15th Ave E. that just opened.  Cleverly called "15th Avenue Coffee and Tea", it sits just down from the giant Group Health hospital complex and across the street from a Safeway Starbucks in a nice little neighborhood with tree lined streets.

As I walked in, my first impression was that I was walking into a deep dark hole. There were lights, to be sure, however they didn't really have a lot of firepower. That left several dark, mysterious corners where God only knows what could take place. 

Along the counter was a series of white plates – a couple had some unidentified pastries, the rest held nothing but crumbs. There were authentic French baguettes placed along a couple of shelves but no prices to be seen. Good thing I wasn't in the mood for a nice, unnamed pastry because there wasn't much of a selection available.

Taped to the back wall was a big ole scrap of butcher paper with three sandwiches listed. A turkey sandwich, a ham sandwich and something else I can't remember. The turkey sandwich sounded interesting so I resolved to include that in my order.

When I got to order, that is.

I am not making this up. I stood there for seven minutes with exactly one customer in front of me. That customer had some questions for the register employee who had to step away from the register to get the answers. The woman was somehow indecisive which also added to the wait. All of that is fine and good. But what isn't fine and good is the fact there were five employees standing around at the coffee station a few feet further down the line and not one of them even bothered to look my way, much less greet me, much less offer to perhaps get a drink started or even, God forbid, answer a question./CONTINUED IN THE FIRST COMMENT

Comments

[JUAN VALDEZ]

I stood there, like an orphan, waiting for someone to acknowledge me. Even the employee at the register couldn't be bothered to note my presence and offer some sort of "hey, I'll be right with you" type of reassurance. But I guess that's what I get for going to a real, down-home, local, non-chain type coffeeshop etc. etc. etc. instead of a Starbucks where, sure, there's been times when I haven't been greeted but most of the time I was at least acknowledged as I waited.

At long last, the woman's order was taken and she trundled off down the line to stand and wait for her drink and I was, like Casey, up to bat.

One of the more interesting things about the back wall display was the menu boards stretch the length of the counter but the ordering takes place near the west end. Which means you have to step away from the register in order to read all of menu offerings. And prices? Forgettaboudit –apparently this is one of those places where if you have to ask the price, you can't afford it. No prices posted anywhere. I was pretty sure I had enough in my backpack to cover the cost so I ordered a turkey sandwich and a latte.

Only to discover they were out of turkey sandwiches. But they had ham sands and the other kind that I can't remember. And I couldn't help but think that it's one thing to be out of a product and have static menu boards that can't be easily changed to reflect that fact. But the sandwich menu was written on big, fat slabs of butcher paper and purposely slapped on the wall with masking tape. How hard would it have been to simply tear that down and quickly rewrite the sandwich menu on a new slab of butcher paper, this time leaving the turkey sandwich off? Or, for that matter, why not take a pair of scissors and cut off the section with the turkey sandwich which was at the top of the listings and retape the remaining paper?

I decided on the ham sand ($7.95) and a latte. And, fairly quickly, it appeared at the place where I picked up my drink. With absolutely no accompanying salutation or wish that I enjoy my meal. Or an attaboy for choosing the ham sandwich because it was an awesome choice and I was gonna really enjoy it. Or anything. Just a fast here you go and quick exit because apparently there was more important things to do behind the counter such as wandering around and looking for something to do.

The ham sandwich was ok. It came on decent artisan type of bread slices and had some remoulade with red onion bits mixed in. It tasted good however I was shocked to see the ham slices were literally pressed together in the same kind of cheap chopped ham brick style you find at the deli at Albertsons. It was as if someone just took a hunk of sliced ham and stuck it between two slices of bread. Even Subway makes an attempt separate the pieces both for presentation's sake and an enjoyable mouthfeel while eating.

And my latte was lukewarm. Geez, it hadn't taken me THAT long to get from the pickup counter to my seat. I thought perhaps I'd gotten more of the nice latte art on top in my first sip so I stirred it up ...same result. Oh well, I didn't need my tongue burned that day anyways.

The shop was steady but not overly busy. Interestingly enough, I could see folks stop at the entrance, gaze inside as if to say "what is this then?" and then move on down the street. But I guess that's the bane of the unknown neighborhood coffee shop – without the branding of a chain like Starbucks, it's hard for people to get an idea what their experience might be like if they were to take the time to venture inside and fork over some cash for products that they won't know the price of in advance.

When I left a while later, they were still advertising turkey sandwiches that weren't available and the white plates had been filled with a bit more product.

Clearly, there wasn't much to celebrate about my visit to this coffeeshop. Apparently they opened not too long ago so there's bound to be some kinks to work out. Presumably, as the employees get more situated, these little blips will disappear from the radar and it will become a well oiled neighborhood gathering place. Because, here's the nut of the whole situation. Despite the misses and the obvious areas which need improvement, I'll be back, over and over again as will, I'm sure, most of the neighborhood. Because, after all, it may have warts but at least it's not a Starbucks.

[ProudlyCanadian]

Oh Juan, how I enjoyed your review of 15th Ave. Coffee and Tea. It is amazing that all the way up here in easter British Columbia, I have heard of that tiny indy coffee shop opening up!

I was thinking of driving the 9ish hours down there on my days off to try it out, but now I think I might hold off, at least until they get their ship in order.
But I've got to ask, compared to the Starbucks brand, how does the washroom cleanliness issue factor in and the indie place?? Just asking!

[Coffee Soldier]

Did you check out the bathrooms?

Just wondering!

[CamSpi]

aw man, that's disappointing. You should go to a cupping and review that and post it in the comment section of this post! If you're able to, at least.

[Melody]

Hi Juan! I thoroughly enjoyed your review of 15th Ave C & T! That's probably because I'm still soaking it up and the novelty of it hasn't worn off yet for me.

Did you notice the clothes-pin chandelier?

I've been taking several friends there, in part because I like hearing their opinion too. So far I've heard things like:

"The theater seats are hard to get in and out of"

"The book on the wall is cool" (Referring to the wall decorated with pages ripped out of a book)

"It's annoying that there are no prices on the menu"

(The book is Plato. ??)

As for me, I was there the other night and had a veggie sandwich (turkey had been scribbled through that they were all out) and it was just an average sandwich. Not particularly great.

Figuring out what food they offer is a trick. One time I was there, there were some great little mini cakes, (small round chocoate or vanilla/strawberry/choc combo cakes) and yet I looked for them last night and didn't see them. I would not have even figured out that ice cream is available if it hadn't been for hearing about that on twitter.

I noticed that the receipts have the wrong twitter address - I am holding a receipt dated 7/26 which says Follow us on twitter ... 15thCoffeeTea but in reality the twitter address is @15thAveCoffee

http://twitter.com/15thAveCoffee

On the plus side, every aspect of the COFFEE part of the coffee house has been lovingly thought out. Every beverage I've had has been perfect. I love that they've adopted a pour over system, and Clover, and I love the fresh-roasted and scooped whole bean selections. Totally happy to find Casi Cielo available when normally that is a seasonal coffee.

The cuppings are total fun. I'm still eating them out. Major has me eating out of the palm of his hand practically. I've been to a number of cuppings with Major now, and one tea cupping too. He knows coffee.

Cuppings are every day at 10 (I've heard Stumptown does them every day (M-F) at 3 - I guess you could hit 2 in one day!).

It's fabulous they have a manual espresso machine too.

I absolutely believe they have the possibility of being a fabulous hit. They got the important parts of it perfect: Coffee and a great atmosphere. The food side of it has kinks to be worked out, but I'm optimistic that will happen.

And just my two-cents, I think the place is too small for live music, but I'm likely the wrong person to comment on that. I'm not much for live music in coffeehouses period. Always too small and rarely the kind of music I enjoy.

Last but not least, I used the internet there on Friday (opening day) with no hitches at all. Nothing to register. Just immediately on line. That seems to be something that everyone wants.

Juan let's meet for coffee there soon! ;-) Come to the cupping tomorrow at 10 - I may be there. :-)

[LAMARZOsm!]

i have a few questions:

-how many timers were going off? (please indicate if it could have been multiple timers going off...24 minute, 12 minute, 8 minute, 10 minute, 2 hr...etc...)
-how many lobby slides took place while you were there?
-dress code? visible tattoos?
-you mentioned an un-stocked pastry area?!? you mean they weren't forced to order more to make it look full?
-what about music?
-was the manager stressed because they weren't meeting their sales targets?
-why is this place "cool" and all the starbucks higher-ups are gaga over it when they force the complete opposite onto actual starbucks stores?

[Melody]

Oh heavens there are some major typos in the above post by me! Blame it on the 102 degree weather in Seattle. Yikes. Obviously I meant that I'm still 'eating up' the cuppings experience. *embarrassed*

[jabanga]

so major is still kicking around out there? major was the learning specialist in new england when i did my rmt and later a dm before heading out to seattle. he's definitely always been a very passionate partner.

[Buggin]

"I stood there, like an orphan, waiting for someone to acknowledge me. " POSTED BY JUAN

Oh my GOD what a tool...what did you expect someone to come rub you off, get a life loser

[Pat Nerr visited 15th Ave and had the same experience as Juan]

Jeeze... even in the "new brand" location the people still have the arrogance needed to work for Starbucks,,, I guess the "F the Customer" attitude will get them the business they deserve...

[adam]

Juan should have ordered a beer chaser for that mediocre latte. If you want to get a good cup you would be better off just going up the street to the Victrola Cafe.

[spence]

Where is BSR? just curious.
I'm enjoying the dialogue without repulsive comments. Not that I'm referring to BSR, of course.

[heather]

here's my yelp review of my recent experience:
15th Avenue Coffee & Tea

Categories: Coffee & Tea, Beer, Wine & Spirits
Neighborhood: Capitol Hill
3 star rating
7/27/2009
Not incredibly impressed.

I normally get a short drink which contains one shot of espresso. This new "inspired by Starbucks" location puts two shots of espresso in all of their drinks. For a short that's just too much espresso (where is there room for the milk?).

They don't accept Starbucks cards (maybe in the mode of somewhat separating themselves?) which is a bummer for me. People often complain of Starbucks high prices, but if you use a starbucks card it's quite cheap as my soy and my sugar free vanilla extras are FREE.

It took forever to get my drink. There was one poor girl making all the drinks for the 4 people that were waiting.

I do like the dark colors and rustic feel. It's also nice not to have a bright light shining in my face. The wifi is incredibly fast and they have cute pictures on the wall.

Kudos for them offering wine. I think I may come back if I feel like sipping on wine while reading a book or studying, but for my regular coffee run there are other better, cheaper places to go.

[heather]

oh and the reason that your latte might have been lukewarm..they don't take the temp they told me. They judge if it's done by how it feels.

[seriously]

@heather: you cannot be serious. just. please tell me that's a joke. by how it -feels-?

[Garch]

it wouldn't be that big of a deal if they knew how to do it! I can temp by hand, stinks that the people working at that store are apparently mediocre barista's...I'd transfer there in a heartbeat, and I'm all the way in Boston!

[Chirp]

@ Seriously

Thats how I learned at starbucks in the late 80's, we steamed the milk till it was just too hot to touch.
This was standard at the times and seeing how proud we used to be in the 70s/80's it worked pretty good :)

[Chirp]

sorry:

It was actually more of a combo hear/feel thing. Listening to the pitch of the milk is probably more important than feel for determining temperature.

[Thought of the Day]

Call me ignorant.... but I just don't get it.... No prices posted? What's the marketing angle? Especially in this economy.
Do they have menus printed with the prices? Are you supposed to ask/not ask.
Wouldn't this tactic just scare people away?

[mini french press]

If you've steamed milk often enough, you should be able to hear when the milk goes into the 130-160 degree zone. I can't describe it but it definitely sounds differently.

That does mean that the baristas should be extremely competent and experienced, however, or else it will go horribly wrong. Competent and experienced baristas should not be making the mistakes described in Juan's post. And they should be able to feel that the milk is not warm enough when they hand off the latte. That's poor barmanship.

[Sedg]

Seriously: I haven't used a thermometer as a matter of course in ooh, two years. Never even get one out unless someone requests a specific temperature. You should be able to both hear and feel when milk is perfect. There's definitely a knack to it, but most experienced baristas could probably do away with the thermometer tomorrow - they just don't realise it.

[J]

Well, most places require us to use thermometers as a matter of heath code.

[Field Partner]

Re: no posted prices

New laws will require posting of nutritional information on menus (not just providing separate pamphlets with the info - actually post the info on the menu). If prices are not listed, it is not considered a "menu" for purposes of this law, so you are not required to post the nutritional information.

A simple way to get around the nanny law.

[Sedg]

J - I've never seen that on any health statue. You don't need to temperature check milk as improperly heated milk can't cause food poisoning. Re-heated milk can, mind.

Then again this is UK law, perhaps US law is different/tighter.

[Melody]

@Field Partner - I think you're 100% right but when this discussion came up before I think we found that Starbucks had some other creative reason for no prices. ?? But yep, the Heritage Store, Univ Village, and 15th C & T all have the same no-prices-menu-board, which under local county rule, are no longer menus without prices thus no nutritional information is required.

The normal Starbucks menu boards with prices are so cluttered with all the calorie information too, imho.

Ah the joy of living in one of the few places with nutritional information required on menus.

[Anthony]

I'm thinking, even though the place is owned by Starbucks, it's obviously not a Starbucks, and the company is obviously trying to conceal that from the public, and so you shouldn't hold it to the same standards as a regular Starbucks.

[waltie]

"Because, after all, it may have warts but at least it's not a Starbucks."

Which begs the logical question: Why do you spend time visiting and reviewing different Starbucks locations? Why are we supposed to take you seriously or think your opinion has the least amount of credibility when you so blatantly point out your negative bias against the subject matter?

Your negative reviews of Starbucks locations is sort of akin to a film reviewing panning, say, There's Something About Marry and then concluding his or her review with, "Oh yeah, and I hate comedies."

[Juan Valdez]

@waltie

Uh...that was supposed to be an ironical statement intended to keep with the theme that runs through the whole column which is we all know I was reviewing a Starbucks even though it's not supposed to look like a Starbucks.

[Jim C]

It is scummy the way we (sbux) are creating new menu boards without prices to skirt nutritional laws. All due respect Mel, but we are not 'one if the few places' where posting nutritional is mandatory, this is happening in major cities all across the US and the EU. Just like smoking laws, they are being passed because of the high cost of heathcare burden on the cities and states. NO OTHER quick service restaurant (QSR) chain has a problem putting the nutritionals out there for all to see, heck McDonalds puts it on their individual items as well as the menu board. We (SBUX) are obsfucating the facts that people Legally have a right to know, instead we are hiding the fact a Venti Frap with whip is 1200 calories. Howard listen! You have seen and heard us present directly to you that this is wrong and we will lose the PR battle on this one, when we should be a leader. Shame! Shame! Howard

[spence]

. . . funny how the discussion of calories/nutrition on signs should be mentioned. Tonight my teenager son was commenting on how silly it is. To quote the teen, "the world is getting too dependent on warnings because people are losing their common sense." He pointed out that "if a person is fat and doesn't want to gain more weight, they should just stop eating fatty products and stick to healthy food." He added, "if they aren't smart enough to know that donuts are fattening, they aren't smart enough to count calories or even know how many calories they should eat daily."

[waltie]

Uh... it still calls your objectivity into question, "Juan." And so does the overly negative tone of almost all of your "reviews." And I put "review" in quotes because I've never gotten the impression from your posts that you are actually looking to review any of these stores, so much as finding as much wrong as possible so you can complain about it on the internet.

And that's fine. In fact, that's entertaining. But don't get all high and mighty when I point out that your "reviews" lack objectivity.

[wishing Dec. 21, 2010 would hurry up]

Didn't sbux try this same "local" flavor concept in San Francisco a number of years ago without success? It appears as though this is one more Howard ego driven idea to grab more money from where ever he thinks the company can make a penny. The last year of labor cuts, layoffs, store closures and a general HATE OF PIKE'S PLACE ROAST(another ego driven idea) has given the company a not so favorable following so this might be the reason the company doesn't want big fanfare in case this place closes in 6 months. Juan, you just keep doing what you do and report the true findings. This weekly post is no different than the daily "Values Walk" that is being done in every store to judge the customers view, right? Longer lines, fewer employees working, less than clean stores, coffee in the afternoons but only if you ask for it(PPR doesn't count otherwise there wouldn't be a twitter/PikePlaceSucks)
One other comment~being that it is the end of July, can someone tell me what all the new manager laptops are capable of doing? Are they the best new tool in the stores?
Will they be able to make beverages during the holidays when the VTI goes back down to -3% or will it go to -5%? Pumpkin Spice will be here sooner than some of us really want. Think they FINALLY got the pumps to work for this next season? Doubtful but we shall see.

[Melody]

Jim C, at least this point most cities/counties do not require nutritional information, but I will give you that it's catching on like wildfire.

I'm just one of those people that find it very unnecessary. It should be common sense to follow the idea "everything in moderation" and it's obvious that a Frappuccino is not meant to be a daily intake. Sometimes it just seems like there is no common sense anymore about what people order. At MSI, it's flooded with people who want low-fat or light whip cream. To me the better answer is rather than put some no-calorie chemical substitution in your body, just have whip cream less often. Sigh. That way of thinking seems to be weird nowadays.

I'm old-fashioned and think that it is simply good customer service to greet and acknowledge customers as quickly as possible. At Eddie Bauer the standard was every customer greeted within 30 seconds of walking in the door. A friend & I were chatting about this, and she believes that you should be acknowledged within 10 seconds of walking in the door to a business.

And I hardly think Starbucks is hiding nutrition information. There are some paper menus at the concept stores with calorie information, and of course it's available on line. I myself simply prefer the clean lines of the chalkboard style menus in place at these concept stores. I can see I am in a losing battle here.

I can happily report there is no Pike Place Roast at 15th Avenue Coffee and Tea.

[@usorthem3]

@StarbucksMelody i love that in your descriptive manner you convey the image in your head so completely. The actual days of a coffee shop w/ following, if you will. Gone but not longed for, the times when you asked someone out for a cup of coffee and it was the way people connected. Jusst love reading what you write, typos and all. LOL Thanks

[CamSpi]

Juan, do you think you'll make it to a tasting??? :D

Melody, 30 seconds does seem like a long time, doesn't it? I love if I'm floating during a rush and grabbing a pastry because I'll get a chance to greet people sometimes, or acknowledge the people waiting in line. :)

Dec.21,2010, The PikePlaceSucks twitter cracks me up. Power to the people! Stick it to the Man.

No nutritional info in DFW. I think a lot of our customers would like that... but it would also confuse a bunch of new customers who don't come in as often.

usorthem3, Wow. Sounds like you're passionate about connecting over coffee! You should be a black apron, or something! LOL. :D

[that_girl]

Melody, to the more intelligent among us it SHOULD be obvious that things like Frappuccinos are not an everyday treat. But a lot of food is either sneakily marketed or has hidden fat/calories you wouldn't guess. Consider the reduced-fat blueberry muffin. Still has 9 grams of fat and more calories than you might guess. It's not really LOW fat, but it's less than the "regular" blueberry muffin.

Or, from another place, any McDonald's salad. It's a salad, it's healthy, right? Except that a lot of the ingredients -- especially the dressing -- is often loaded with fat, salt, etc. I heard that one restaurant chain recently revamped much of their food for it to be healthier, and took one salad from over 1,000 calories down to about 300. So what was in there before that had 700 extra calories?

So much processed food relies on health "auras" to seem healthier than it is. Given the sneaky marketing tactics many places use, I think it's necessary to SHOW people what they are eating. Maybe when we can all see the fat content and calorie counts, we'll start demanding better ingredients and healthier food.

[eleanor abernathy]

What was the music like in this location? Typical Starbucks soundtrack or indie music that was selected by the hipster baristas?

[Juan Valdez]

@camspi

Who knows? I might make it to a cupping or a tasting. Are they just on weekdays?

[CamSpi]

I saw a cute little sign that said they do it every day at 10 am. I have not physically witnessed the sign, so I don't know if its still there or not. :/ I don't know how your schedule works, but if you've got the extra time, pop in at 10 am, and if they're not doing it... try some coffee a la the pour over method. I've been talking to Sbux Gossipers about this interesting brew method.

[run from the laptops]

LOL @ laptops!

While this topic is very OP, I doubt we will see laptops anytime soon.

Technically, the company cannot make you work from home or send emails, etc. because they would have to compensate you for using your own equipment.

Ultimatley, ALS is going away and "online" scheduling is supposed to replace it. However, this was a "dream" that had no vendor or actual software. A lot of the people at the SSC who were involved in these projects were let go.

The true value of a sm laptop would be that manager's could have all non-coverage removed, and being salaries, sitll have to produce reports and schedules. They could now do these things legally at home with a lap top issued to them.

If you are an SM in want of the lap top... DONT EVEN THINK ABOUT IT. BUt seriously, until they can align a cost savings to their deployment, I doubt we will see these soon.

[SBUCKS DRONE LOS ANGELES]

It sounds to me like they're just sort of running this place with a "who gives a damn, let's improvise and see where it takes us" attitude. Maybe it's being done on purpose. Maybe it's Sbux's attempt at being "real" again, with 16,000 plus stores being the "norm". Who knows.

[SBUCKS DRONE LOS ANGELES]

"Sometimes it just seems like there is no common sense anymore about what people order" -Posted by Melody

Touché Melody.

Nominated for Starbucksgossip.com Quote of the Year.

[BaristaDude]

that's a funny website, 'buy'. You're in Tel Aviv? LOL. Gotta lot of broken links too.

[ChaseW]

Seriously, is anyone really surprised by this??? SBUX has become so irrelevant it's not even funny. If they can't fix their own business what reason do they have to open a NEW one??? Remember when ALL the big airlines did this a few years back and all they did was compete w/themselves and cannibalize the 'brand'???. United had 'Ted', Delta had 'Song' and Us Airways had 'Metro Air'. Are ANY of those airlines w/in an airline still around today??? NO!!!

[Warren Zupman]

Just saw this came out today. More polished treatment. http://www.ddimagazine.com/displayanddesignideas/galleries/hospitality/index.jsp

[bob jain]

i love starbucks!...;)